New xSharpees.. or is X#phobes

[TerryB1]

Phil
I do not disagree with any of the points you make. But none of that, to my mind, conflicts with the basic statement “the way programs work (on a digital platform)” does not change. It does not change whether the platform is pc, tablet, or whatever. They are all digital platforms which our programs control. And, yes we need to take different approaches to how we develop and effect that control (our programs).

(Just in case you’re wondering OK so what? I’ll get to it, so hang on)

The fact is that the electronic operation underlying it all (including shuttling backwards and forwards to the cloud) must and does obey the basic natural laws of physics that we see in the real world. These laws determine and limit what we, ourselves can do, and in particular how quickly we can do things.
Time is the essential factor to get to grips with. Digital electronics, can these days operate at phenomenal speed. Far, far greater than the speed at which we ourselves can do things – timespans measured in nano-seconds. But even this speed is slow when compared to the speed of light.

I have explained some of this in greater detail in the referenced post.

The point here is that VO before it and now the way managed code is implemented allows us to conceptually forget all about memory management. Indeed, forget all about timing constraints – none of these take effect until our programs actually run. Understanding becomes easier
.
So where is this pointing as far as program development in a .NET based language is concerned?

To my mind it points to greater emphasis being placed on optimal use of the language syntax as it develops. By so doing, more and more coding constructs will be able to be translated to the IL Assembler directly by the language compiler, meaning that errors can be detected at compile time rather that jumping out as exceptions when the code is run.

I hope this makes some sense.
Terry

[NickFriend]

Hi Phil,

Long time no see or hear.... nice to see you around here!

Re. web vs desktop I actually think you can get to a happy medium. I'm fighting a constant rearguard action against web apps here, basically because I'm a fossil and I think the user interface experience in a web app vs a desktop is absolutely crap (I'm going to get a heap of flak for that!).

So we replaced our old vertical market VO application with an N-tier version, whereby there's a client desktop application which communicates with a remote server app that actually handles the data. This gives us the best of both worlds, the quality of UI experience of a desktop (we use WPF) but the global reach of a web app. Only downside obviously is the need to install some software on the client machines.

Using interfaces to define the data service calls also means that we can easily swap out the data access layer and make the same software run on a single machine, so we can even sell to small customers who just want our software on their laptop for instance, which our competitors can't do.

So I'd keep an open mind about desktop.... we've all seen IT fads going round and round over time.

Nick

[Sherlock]

Nick / all

Happy medium.. sure there is a transition in place say ONpremises, Hybrid and cloud. We have a lot of hybrid services now and for say 12+ years and more and more we move system to the cloud. xSHARP will be a good project to move another large system that way. Has anybody with xSharp then used the code set in MONO under Linux. We have built a few systems that way, C# . NET and into Mono, Linux in Amazon, Would like to do same with xSHARP. Just runs with less resources and cost to run.

The killer for us as Onpremises hardware needs a say $600o to $12000 upgrade they look for cloud to not spend the money and cost us some very long term clients. The calls for new business mention server local or VM and costs the sale is dead most times.

[robert]

Phil,
I am not sure if anyone uses X# in production on Mono, but a few years ago Fabrice already demonstrated an X# winforms app on Mono on a Raspberry PI connecting to a MySql database on his laptop. It worked better than we expected.

Robert

[rjpajaron]

Hi Robert,

Why stop there. Mono is the basis of .NET WebAssembly (wasm) that are running on Blazor which currently on preview status, soon to be part of .NET Core 3 by September. My web dev right now is experimenting on it.

Cant wait trying X# assembly called by C# on Blazor. Just a thought....

Regards,

Rene

[Sherlock]

Robert

We will give it a try.. when we are at that stage.
I was impressed that without code change it works.
These were services that generate web interface.
Under Linux less rebooting more reliable, servicing etc.
Before the Windows / Linux flame we do both we can speak from experience.

Phil

[lumberjack]

Hi.. many I know many of you from Clipper, VO, Vulcan or CULE. Met t many CA events great memories and travels.
So Hi and the journey begins.

Hi Phil,
Great to see you back with us, as was always the case, we all here to help and assist each other as we know from the Clipper/VO days and hopefully soon also the XBase++ and VFP guys.

Welcome back and happy X#ing.